Hot oil

[richhenning]

Hi guys,

mate and I took the kids for a day at Stockton last week, we had a great time. It was my first ever beach driving experience, didn't know what I was doing! Luckily my mate has plenty of experience with his ford ranger diesel. It was 40'c on the beach and we were on the upper soft sand when the auto started drifting into any old gear and the bells went off, with 'hot oil' message on the dash. I assumed the transmission oil was overheating and stopped straightaway.
Rested for a bit and carried on towards Anna bay when it happened again. We let the jeep cool down again, while we all swam some more.
Decided that Anna bay was too far, so we turned back towards lavis lane, this time staying on the harder stuff near the waters edge, which seemed it suit the jeep much better.
no more dramas and left the beach ok.
The ranger was amazing, lots of diesel grunt and nimble all over the sand. The petrol jeep in 4H felt like hard work in the soft sand.

Anyway, just sharing and interested in any transmission coolant solutions that may be around.
cheers
rich

[TRBN8R]

Use low range on the beach...... Or do the steering dance to turn off the ESP on the sand......

Sent from Asus Fonepad using Tapatalk

[Rob.79]

Stockton is a great day out, looks like you had a good time, could be an idea for a club day out?I've been up there a few times now, I went from lavis lane, came off at the north end and drove down onto Samurai Beach, spent the weekend in Nelsons Bay, then did the drive back down Stockton.

The transmission and engine need to work pretty hard push through the soft stuff though, could explain the high temp, I just chugged steadily along in 3rd low most of the way...

Rob


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[DanD]

I'm struggling to recall if I was in 4hi or 4lo when the Jeeps on the Beach day was on last year (Hunty, Alex, Sol, Andy, et al - any hints on this?) I do know that I was (at the time) unlifted and with stock tyres and had no problems at all! Even managed a few 'fishies' when driving along which I'm pretty sure Sol caught on gopro - Hunty also has copies of my video from the day... Including the 'Samurai Beach' area where "what has been seen cannot be unseen" hehehe

[Rob.79]

Yeah, hahaha, I was told afterwards Samurai was a nudist beach! Luckily I went in July, must have been too cold........


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[Paul-JK]

Hi Rich,

Couple of questions:
- What tyre pressures were you running?
- Did you turn off the ESP, either just with the switch on the dash (hold it for 7 seconds I think) or through some other means?

If it was struggling then perhaps you could have dropped a few more psi out of the tyres.
Also, while I've heard the diesels do quite well on the sand in 4Hi, the petrol may be better in 4Lo as they don't produce as much torque, especially if it's that hot and the sand is so soft.
Lastly, and most importantly, you absolutely have to turn off the ESP when driving on sand otherwise it is constantly detecting spinning wheels, then tries to brake those wheels or reduce engine power. Both of those make it even harder to move forward so you stomp down harder and it just gets worse and worse. That will drive the temperatures up massively. There have been a few cases in the states of petrol JK's (they're all petrol in the states) setting on fire while driving on sand and that is suspected to be the cause. That's obviously a very extreme scenario but you get the point, you need to turn ESP off. I think by holding the switch for 7 seconds it only disables it until you next turn off the car. Once you re-start then you need to turn ESP off again.

I think it's just about finding the right set up (tyre pressures, gearing etc) for the conditions as most say the JK's do well on the sand, especially with the stock tyres on.

One other thing, did you leave it in D or did you use 1 or 2? Might be an idea to leave it in 2 and only put it in D if you need to drive over 50km/hr or so, or are driving on firmer sand. By leaving it in D I suspect it'll keep the torque converter unlocked for more of the time and that will also generate a lot more heat in the transmission. Keep in 2 and the torque converter will lock up much earlier and that'll keep the temps down better.

[Paul-JK]

Yeah, hahaha, I was told afterwards Samurai was a nudist beach! Luckily I went in July, must have been too cold........

Yeh, and now you're suggesting a club trip back up there in summer. Me think someone wants to go back for another look :eagerness: :highly_amused:

[AV8]

ESP KILL SWITCH (http://www.flickr.com/photos/zombieite/8479663011/in/set-72157632785264438/)

Not sure if this will help but I've been told that it does. Def gonna do it to ours when we order our '15 JK. Going for the sports + Poison Spider, me thinks.

[Rob.79]

Hahaha, no no. I'd be happy just to goto Stockton..

Soft sand saps a lot of power, low tyre pressures are a must, I,d say 18-20psi max, and then lower sone more if your still struggling, and low range makes life easier for the transmission and engine... It's a drain even walking across soft sand, so a 2.5ton (ish) 4x4 is gonna feel the burn!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[richhenning]

Thanks for your thoughts everyone.
I am keen to try again for sure. Tires were down to 18psi, didn't want to go any lower with just my mate and I there.
I tried to switch ESP off, but obviously didnt hold the button long enough, and then assumed it couldn't be switched off in 4H. Looking back, I can recall ESP was flashing like mad on the dash, and my friend was adamant that ESP should be off.
I was definitely harder on the gas than the ranger, and left the Auto in D.
So a few lessons learnt and can't wait to try some different approaches next time, firstly using 4L.
cheers,
rich

[Paul-JK]

18psi is good place to start but in really soft sand I'm guessing you could go lower if needed.

With the ESP, if you just push the button it reduces the intrusiveness of the ESP. This is what is sounds like you did if the light was still flashing. You need to hold for 7 seconds to switch it off completely. That's in 2Hi or 4Hi. ESP is switched off automatically when you use 4Lo.

I'd give it a go leaving the transmission in 2 if you're in 4Hi and that should help. Probably leave it in D if you're in 4Lo as 2nd won't give you much speed at all and I think the torque converter locks up a lot quicker (if not all the time) in 4Lo anyway.

[dobbo56]

Hi Rich, you need to put an Auto Transmission Cooler on the JKU, I put one on mine at the last toolbox day, cost around $150.00, and a relatively easy job, but a necessary piece of kit on the pre 12 JK's, 16 psi in 245s have found, is the optimum pressure in soft sand ,Hope this helps Doggy Dave...

[DanD]

Hi Rich, you need to put an Auto Transmission Cooler on the JKU, I put one on mine at the last toolbox day, cost around $150.00, and a relatively easy job, but a necessary piece of kit on the pre 12 JK's, 16 psi in 245s have found, is the optimum pressure in soft sand ,Hope this helps Doggy Dave...

+1 From memory I was down to about 15 psi when on stock tyres @ Stockton

[richhenning]

Great, thanks for the info Dave and Dan.

[DanD]

Great, thanks for the info Dave and Dan.

Have you got your lift & sway bar disconnects in yet? Where's the pics???????

[richhenning]

Ha ha , Not yet Dan, waiting to book into ATV soon!

[Paul-JK]

Hi Rich,

Basic lift kit is easy enough to fit on garage floor if you want to, or at a Wooder's toolbox day. I've had mine in/out by myself too many times to count, though it's easier with 2 pairs of hands. Fitted a kit to a friends JK on his driveway as well. It's not that difficult and with a little liquid persuasion I'm sure a few more hands could be found to speed up the process. By all means pay ATV to do it if you wish but that's a few hundred $ you could put into the next investment.

What lift kit are you getting?

[richhenning]

Thanks Paul, ATV are doing the whole lot for me:
- lift - http://www.doubleblackoffroad.com/jeep-wrangler-parts/Teraflex-Jeep-JK-Wrangler-2-5--Performance-Budget-Boost-
- MTZ tyres
- disconnects
- probably auto cooler as well
great guys and I don't mind the small labour charge to have it all done and dusted. Should be ready in the next few weeks.
Thanks for the offer though.

[DanD]

Looking good so far mate! In all honesty, I do wish that I saved up and got springs & shocks as opposed to the AEV spacer kit (all things said and done, this is my first 4x4, so this lift business is all quite new to me and tyre noise - WOW - I don't mind the noise from the muddies going @ 110k/hr, but just make sure that you have a good playlist going through the stereo ;) ) In rambling that, grow with your JK, I'm certain that mine will go further than I will allow it - the disconnects and better tyres will see you through quite a lot more than you expect :)


Thanks Paul, ATV are doing the whole lot for me:
- lift - http://www.doubleblackoffroad.com/jeep-wrangler-parts/Teraflex-Jeep-JK-Wrangler-2-5--Performance-Budget-Boost-
- MTZ tyres
- disconnects
- probably auto cooler as well
great guys and I don't mind the small labour charge to have it all done and dusted. Should be ready in the next few weeks.
Thanks for the offer though.

[Paul-JK]

No problem. Looking forward to seeing it all fitted up and giving it a test!

Auto cooler is a good idea, and it's easy in the petrol JK's. Simple cooler in front of the radiator. I want to get one fitted to mine but with the diesel I've already got the intercooler there so the extra auto cooler won't fit (or won't be too effective amongst the other coolers). Something else on the long, long list of things to sort out one day.

[richhenning]

Yep it is indeed a long list.....the more I learn, the longer and more involved the list becomes!

[DanD]

Yep it is indeed a long list.....the more I learn, the longer and more involved the list becomes!

Just
Empty
Every
Pocket

;) there is no end, approach it just like a snickers or mars bar, just one bite at a time :D

[redrubi]

I'm struggling to recall if I was in 4hi or 4lo when the Jeeps on the Beach day was on last year (Hunty, Alex, Sol, Andy, et al - any hints on this?) I do know that I was (at the time) unlifted and with stock tyres and had no problems at all! Even managed a few 'fishies' when driving along which I'm pretty sure Sol caught on gopro - Hunty also has copies of my video from the day... Including the 'Samurai Beach' area where "what has been seen cannot be unseen" hehehe
Say No to NUDE DUDES!!!

[redrubi]

LOW 4 + LOW Tyre pressure + LOW Speed = GOOD RESULTS:encouragement:

[DanD]

Say No to NUDE DUDES!!!

What has been seen cannot be unseen

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q211/WhiteMeatVarmint/samurai_zps1351fdd1.jpg

[redrubi]

what has been seen cannot be unseen

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q211/whitemeatvarmint/samurai_zps1351fdd1.jpg
why would you keep that???

[DanD]

why would you keep that???

It was a screen grab from the video I have of (almost) the entire day